Investing in the Future of Medicine

Published on
December 20th, 2017
23 minutes

Investing in the Future of Medicine

The Expert View ·
Featuring Robert Maxwell

Published on: December 20th, 2017 • Duration: 23 minutes

Robert Maxwell of Privateer Capital takes a close look at recent advancements in cancer treatment, and explains how he’s investing around them. Specifically, he's looking at cryogenic logistics stocks, which play a key role in the cutting-edge treatment process. He also speaks about how to integrate volatile biotech stocks into a balanced portfolio. Filmed December 13, 2017 in Austin, Texas.


  • KS
    Kenneth S.
    6 January 2019 @ 07:39
    To consider any biotech company. 1. Management Team 2. Investors 3. IP Kite Pharma was the no brainer. Everyone else went for the song and dance.
  • MM
    Matthew M.
    5 July 2018 @ 04:23
    Robert killed it with his picks in this video, probably the most lucrative advice and tickers mentioned in the last 6-8 months on RV. A follow up considering all these companies made huge advances would be great
  • DH
    Daniel H.
    4 July 2018 @ 11:04
    Amazing content and is performing very well. RV comes through again 👍
  • TS
    Tim S.
    31 December 2017 @ 16:46
    Enjoyed this interview thoroughly. Setting aside the discussions about the technologies it was fun to see how he entered into his observations and how his knowledge and understanding were self-generated. He seemed candid about his positions and risk and I could see myself caught in some of the same dilemma regarding risk vs reward. A fun watch for me and I enjoy thinking for myself wrt outcomes and assessments - no echo chamber here.
  • LK
    Lyle K.
    21 December 2017 @ 17:34
    RV you have to get people who spent more than a year and a half worth of experience. Difficult for me to take this seriously 7-8 yrs experience should be minimum for a RV video. RV is know for crème de la crème guests..... don't change it.
    • LK
      Lyle K.
      21 December 2017 @ 17:41
      Nothing against Robert Maxwell I am sure he is intelligent just RV has paying customers and we should get solid professionals.
    • ek
      eric k.
      25 December 2017 @ 02:56
      just because he stutters and doesn't sound like a boxing announcer, you're dissing him
    • LK
      Lyle K.
      25 December 2017 @ 16:21
      eric k. The reason I comment on this is because their is no possible way that any person on earth can learn one of the most complex fields of medicine in a year and a half. This is a study that can take decades of learning to fully understand it .
    • DF
      Daniel F.
      25 December 2017 @ 21:44
      Lyle actually has a point. It's hard to be an authority figure on something with such little experience. Maybe we misunderstood his background. For example, what was he doing 2 years ago and before.
  • RH
    Robert H.
    25 December 2017 @ 09:40
    Interesting to see people finally discussing dendritic cells and NWBO (check out the pages at Kat’s Cure on Facebook. This lady in the UK managed to get DCVax after being diagnosed with GBM and she is in no doubt it cured her disease). Personalised medicine is a clear trend, I think that he focused too much on the search for an off-the-shelf product. Also, unfortunately up till now, contrary to what Robert said there is very limited evidence that CarT will work on solid tumours and much evidence that it does not. They simply cannot control the side effects and I agree with Steve D, he’s wrong about the cost. It’s way too expensive. The Gliead call after the purchase of Kite was quite telling. At the Q&A the first 4 or 5 questions from different sell-side analysts were along the lines of ‘do you see this purchase as a move into solid tumours?’ and of course the CEO and COO both said emphatically yes. But when the chief scientific guy answered he said yes, but any progress in solid tumours will be in the ‘very distant future’.
  • PS
    Paul S.
    21 December 2017 @ 03:53
    Oxford Biomedica Plc is an interesting name (shameless pump) dealing successfully so far with Novartis But I noted recently Crispin Odey has it as a large holding - so that could be the kiss of death! In all seriousness - this is such an important and interesting space I would love to keep hearing more on the topic
    • SD
      Stephen D. | Contributor
      22 December 2017 @ 03:03
      Paul. You are right that Oxford Biomedica (OXB) is an interesting play on CAR-T, and gene therapy manufacturing generally. However you are wrong that Odey has a large holding. Odey do not appear on the shareholder regiser of OXB. Odey do own 9.91% of Oxford Biodynamics (OBD) which is, like OXB, a spin out from Oxford Univerity, but is focused on Epigentic diagnostics, not immunotherapy. Also an interesting company, very different business, very similar name.
    • PS
      Paul S.
      22 December 2017 @ 23:29
      Phew! Appreciate the correction
  • KO
    Kieran O.
    22 December 2017 @ 19:13
    Never ceases to amaze me how ageist some of the subscribers here are. Granted I don't agree with his views, I think immuno and gene therapies are not only ridiculously overhyped but also completely misunderstood. That said, his way of playing the biotech community's inevitable push towards these inefficient and limited therapies is quite clever.
  • RO
    Robert O.
    22 December 2017 @ 05:10
    Any comment on the ETF CNCR, which has many of the names mentioned, but does not include CYRX? I purchased this ETF several months ago when another Real Vision contributor described their investment in immunotherapy space. I have a small speculative position so the potential loss is small but if one of the companies in the ETF show a bitcoin type of rise some of the other companies may follow. I thought this was a safer way of betting on this sector than trying to guess which company will be the big winner.
  • DG
    Don G.
    21 December 2017 @ 01:33
    NWBO - If he can talk his book so can I. I thought it was great.
    • SD
      Stephen D. | Contributor
      22 December 2017 @ 03:33
      NWBO is a very intersting company. But CAR-t now has two FDA approved treatments: Novartis Kymirah (the vector for which is made by Oxford Biomedica) for Paediatric ALL and Kite (now part of Gilead) Yescarta for DLBCL. NWBO have been developing their dendtitic cell cancer treatment for GBM for years. To date without success. It would also be fair to say that the CEO, Linda Powers, is a controversial character and the stock has been a terrible performer. IF they can make their dendritic cell treatment work it will be a game changer but this stock is very high risk even for this space.
  • SD
    Stephen D. | Contributor
    22 December 2017 @ 03:23
    This is a fascinating space and Robert hasd clealrly thought a lot about the topic despite clealrly not being a scientific expert. However he is just plain wrong on the affordability of CAR-T. Yes, Kymirah is US$475k, but it's a single 'one and done treatment'. After this the child is 'immune' from Acute Lymphobastic Leukemia (ALL) as far as we know from Emily Whitehead, patient #1 5 years on. If treatment is ineffective Novartis return the fee, unlike Escarta. As Kymirah is currently for Refractory or Relapsed (RR) Paediatric ALL it is targeting at children who have no other treatment options and are therefore highly likely to die soon. As far as we know after CAR-T they are able to lead a normal life. Based on a Quality-adjusted life years basis Kymirah is much cheaper and more effective that drugs which address chronic conditions but require constant drug treatments.
  • TH
    Tomi H.
    21 December 2017 @ 00:56
    Thank you for bringing this up! CAR-T has indeed shown fantastic breakthroughs in the treatment of hematological malignancies and also some promising results in solid tumors. I still have to bring up just couple issues that we have to deal with, when thinking about the science behind all of this AND investing in these companies. First, I would have to say that the ultimate success of CAR-T in solid tumor patients will require lots of improvements in the following areas in clinical work: 1, Local delivery of CAR-T cells. 2, Combination of CAR-T cells with chemotherapeutic drugs to treat metastatic tumors. 3, Combination of CAR-T with immune checkpoint inhibitors. 4, Combination therapy using CAR-T cells targeting two different antigens. 5, The use of CAR-T as a strategy to prevent tumor recurrence and metastasis after radical resection. I've studied the basic immunology and science behind cancer immunotherapies in med school and then done some more profound research on the subject myself. All I can say is that this is one of the hardest subjects to understand and the whole immune system is very complex and still not very well understood. Especially cancer immunology. When thinking about development projects, we also have to always keep in mind that even though something looks promising in pre-clinical studies, it can turn out to be a disaster in clinical studies, because living human body is much more complex system than a bunch of cells in a petri dish. So this is the starting point. Then we know that biotech companies and especially many development projects around cancer therapies can easily become "over hyped", so investors in this space need to be very well informed and educated in every possible way so that we can even talk about having some kind of edge in the space. I've been investing in this space for years and because of my background I consider myself to be quite well informed and educated, but still I get sometimes very anxious understanding how to play this game. From what I usually see, I just can't help being skewed towards seeing more short opportunities than more long opportunities. I mean, of course you can find good companies to go long (and I have too), but because of the dynamics around these companies I would argue that the probabilities are greater for the informed one who looks for the short opportunities. It is a very hard space to be invested in and definitely the most unlikely place for an investor to find an edge. But I hope the science turns out like Robert says and I personally think also that we will see enormous advantages in this space of cancer therapies over the next years. Just be aware of what kind of game this from investors standpoint.
    • GM
      Gavin M.
      21 December 2017 @ 04:20
      As someone who works professionally in this space I agree with Tomi’s thoughtful comments. While Robert has highlighted that there is much to be encouraged about with the new treatment modalities there are many challenges that still need to be overcome. We also need to understand that the Novartis/Kite/Juno therapies are 20+ years in the making. While there is an ecosystem being developed around these therapies new start-ups investors should be aware that the smart money is moving in with a number of large sophisticated medical and life science companies building capabilities in the space. The developers of the therapies often like to work with larger more sophisticated players because they can provide more comprehensive solutions and can be counted on to be there for the long haul. This is a complex and dynamic space and does not lend itself to a casual understanding
    • CS
      C S.
      21 December 2017 @ 07:54
      Cancer is the modern plague (save antibiotic resistance, a virulent form of interspecies influenza, etc). We're pretty good on lymphomas, but carcinomas are still a bugger. I've been wondering where the results of millions spent on research are. Hopefully soon more strides made.
    • SD
      Stephen D. | Contributor
      22 December 2017 @ 03:10
      Excellent comments. Could I also add to your list of CAR-T challenges for solid tumours: 6. An ability to manage a Cytokine Storm from the tumour breaking up if the treatment is too effective.
  • PU
    Peter U.
    21 December 2017 @ 23:49
    Not RV's best, that is for sure
  • ML
    Michael L.
    21 December 2017 @ 06:12
    I like these industry specific pieces. Would have been even better if it was longer
  • DC
    Darrell C.
    21 December 2017 @ 04:37
    Most will lose money in this sector. From experience, you have to follow a company for years, not just only 12 months, to get a handle on the management execution, AND most importantly, being able to enter at a very low price after all the initial hype. You may have gamble on 10 names hoping one will payoff.....
  • RA
    Richard A.
    20 December 2017 @ 14:45
    I love Real Vision but have to say I hate, I am using the word hate here, the "serious/poignant" music that is used throughout this and many other videos.
    • RP
      Raoul P. | Founder
      20 December 2017 @ 19:55
      Yeah, me too...Im on the case. Thanks!
    • SS
      Steven S.
      21 December 2017 @ 03:51
      I love Real Vision also and thoroughly enjoy the music. Not sure sure why, but "The World on a Brink" music, for example, sets the perfect tone (no pun intended) for the documentary.
  • CE
    Carl E.
    20 December 2017 @ 22:38
    I listen to these so I can’t hear the “typed questions”. Can you please update this style of presentation for those particularly focused on just audio. Thanks.
    • MA
      Melanie A.
      21 December 2017 @ 00:01
      Yes, I agree - would be helpful to have audio for both the typed questions and the summary at the end
  • Jc
    Justin c.
    20 December 2017 @ 16:15
    I am not real encouraged by the fact that his holding period is one year. Do I want to be the bag holder?