Circle: Driving Transaction Costs Down to Zero

Published on
January 22nd, 2021
65 minutes

Circle: Driving Transaction Costs Down to Zero

The Interview - Crypto ·
Featuring Jeremy Allaire and Raoul Pal

Published on: January 22nd, 2021 • Duration: 65 minutes

Circle co-founder, chairman, and CEO Jeremy Allaire joins Raoul Pal, Real Vision CEO, to discuss stable coins, regulation, and the problems that Circle is working to solve. Allaire explains that Circle was created to improve the way traditional money, or fiat, was transacted. This vision led the company to helping build out USDC, a fully backed stable coin. Allaire believes that once there is a fiat digital currency model on public networks, this would drive the cost of transacting value close to zero. He also states that regulation of the crypto space implies acceptance from governments and institutions and that this is a good sign for crypto. Filmed on January 14, 2021. Key Learnings: Transacting in the traditional banking system is expensive and slow compared to the new crypto payment and settlement rails. Fiat digital currencies can assist in dramatically reducing the cost of value transactions and can grow the utility of crypto networks dramatically. Consequently, a secure fiat digital currency can encourage governments and institutions adopt crypto networks.



  • DL
    David L.
    3 February 2021 @ 08:06
    Really good discussion on some of the "big picture" issues of the cryptocurrency ecosystem.
  • TV
    Tyrell V.
    30 January 2021 @ 23:32
    Benchmark Protocol is a fascinating crypto which also uses the VIX as part of its hedge against liquidity... Only has $4.5m mkt cap right now!
  • ND
    Nivtej D.
    27 January 2021 @ 18:15
    Great guest and topic. Circle is a major player or will be. Esp with ECB. I get the boys have to be careful about what they say but I think tether got a bit of a pass in the interview. Chico Crypto does a cool piece on it ...sorry can find the link.
  • jM
    john M.
    27 January 2021 @ 02:20
    that was a great video awesome love bring more
    • jM
      john M.
      27 January 2021 @ 02:21
      john M. Jan 26, 2021 @ 21:20 1 0 that was a great video awesome love bring more
  • WN
    Walter N.
    23 January 2021 @ 17:43
    “You know” is exhausting. Even though I love the information I cannot go beyond 30 minutes of “you know”.
    • EB
      Edward B.
      26 January 2021 @ 06:14
      "i know"
  • EB
    Edward B.
    26 January 2021 @ 06:12
    Allaire gave some outstanding insight; especially with respect to the institutional market. It may be a tough sell to get some corporate boards to commit to Bitcoin, but they "all" will be interested in a 10% range interest yield! The insurance companies and pension funds in particular will jump on this. 3,000 companies showing serious consideration? I actually believe that number isn't hyped much, if at all. Wow!!
  • MS
    Martin S.
    25 January 2021 @ 22:22
    Minute 20: Raoul is a good interviewer, pushing back...Now, if you take this to the extreme, where you have positive real rates in bitcoin and negative ones in fiat currencies, would you not have Gresham's law unfolding in the savings market? I mean, people saving in bitcoin and spending in fiat, particularly if the technology around making bitcoin the settlement vehicle for the thousands of mini capital markets we will have, continues improving. This is what happens today in places like Argentina, where people save in hard currency and spend pesos. I would not like to be a central banker these days, but if I was one and wanted to stop this thing on its feet, I would support going back to the gold standard. At least that way, I can keep a segnoriage when it comes to the financial system. If the systemically important banks of today were still owned by founders or activist investors, I can imagine these lobbying to get back to the gold standard. But they are not. They are semi-public and hence, management have no skin in the game.
  • BT
    Boris T.
    25 January 2021 @ 13:04
    Great interview. One point I thought wasn’t as well covered as the rest though is CBDCs. Definitely agree with Raoul’s point that relying on existing private stablecoins wouldn’t really give central banks what they are looking for (I.e. a strong grip on all monetary transaction in order to enforce very granular monetary and fiscal policies and move towards behavioural economics). Jeremy didn’t really seem to have an answer to that point.
  • ML
    Michael L.
    25 January 2021 @ 10:02
    Thx Raoul for this insightful interview. Good to hear Jeremy's thoughts on USDC vs. U.S. CBDC--how these concepts might realistically coexist. It is hard to imagine a government going-it-alone.
  • cw
    chris w.
    25 January 2021 @ 03:26
    great interview. very insightful.
  • cw
    chris w.
    25 January 2021 @ 03:26
    great interview. very insightful.
  • NL
    Nikola L.
    24 January 2021 @ 23:39
    one of the best crypto interviews on RV. Thank You.
  • IH
    Ian H.
    24 January 2021 @ 19:48
    Fascinating! Well done Raoul....
  • RC
    Robert C.
    24 January 2021 @ 13:53
    Wow the future is crazy
  • CD
    Carl D.
    24 January 2021 @ 04:29
    this was amazing
  • MD
    Matt D.
    24 January 2021 @ 03:38
    Great interview Raoul. Thanks. Enjoy these crypto space interviews - with respected guests like Jeremy. Cheers.
  • LS
    Lewis S.
    23 January 2021 @ 00:56
    • AD
      Andrew D.
      24 January 2021 @ 03:02
      also bugged me lol
  • LW
    Lawrence W.
    23 January 2021 @ 20:14
    Hey Raoul, great interview. I'm really pleased that you asked Jeremy about recent developments in the Lightning Network and in particular what his thoughts were on Bottlepay and Strike Global. These two companies are developing products which really push Bitcoin as a means of exchange above and beyond its current status as a store of value. I messaged Pete Cheyne, the founder of Bottlepay, on their company telegram today and he said he'd be keen to do an interview with you. I think the potential these companies have to disintermediate international payments whether through SWIFT or Western Union, is huge and will have large implications on remittances and Forex in general in the near future. Furthermore, domestically these products could allow merchants to circumvent payment processors such as Visa and MasterCard which currently take a 2% cut on average. An interview with Pete Cheyne or Jack Mallers of Strike Global would provide a huge amount of value to your viewers as most probably don't yet realise how close Bitcoin/LN is for prime time.
  • JA
    JAK A.
    23 January 2021 @ 19:53
    Thanks Raoul,again a great interview.
  • AP
    Alex P.
    22 January 2021 @ 14:59
    I expect all thumbs up for this. Guys got a great mind and solid knowledge and experience in this space. I also like how his company is protocol agnostic. He was very vague on his opinion about Lightning network which is a smart move. Very few know how much of a train wreck BTC truly is but soon many will know, including Raoul. But BTC is a major player for Jeremy right now, so kudos sir, on staying vague and neutral. The real bitcoin is getting ready to roar.
    • SW
      Steve W.
      22 January 2021 @ 16:21
      Why is BTC a 'train wreck'? Jeremy just explained that he expects it to be held by central banks / treasuries? Didn't sound very vague and neutral to me when he said as soon as he can he'll run USDC on bitcoin? So what is the real bitcoin? and if you say BSV or XRP then you are truly crazy.
    • IB
      Iain B.
      22 January 2021 @ 17:15
    • CH
      Crag H.
      22 January 2021 @ 18:33
      Bitcoin have been forked over 6500 times. But yeah. Your Bitcoin will definitely be the one.
    • TP
      Timothy P.
      22 January 2021 @ 19:05
      Every time one of these "real bitcoin" people come on here, I just see Craig Wright and Calvin Ayre lurking behind them. Good lord. Look at your rolling drawdown or any other metric - BSV is garbage, so is BCH - and I'm talking in real investor terms, with its performance in the absolute basement. Lightning is evolving, and Taproot with Schnorr Signatures is already merged into the Bitcoin codebase, just waiting on the proper time for activation.
    • AP
      Alex P.
      22 January 2021 @ 22:13
      Timothy P. You are flat out idiot with way to much BTC in your pockets, mate. Good luck and let the ponzi parade keep doing the research for you. Peace be with you.
    • TP
      Timothy P.
      22 January 2021 @ 23:43
      @Alex P - Considering the source, I'm not offended. I've multiplied my value over the years with Bitcoin. You can't say the same about your assets, can you? (Rhetorical -- you can't.) Keep fuming and staying poor, I guess.
    • RK
      Ron K.
      23 January 2021 @ 16:03
      what is "The real bitcoin that is getting ready to roar" - you are vague this. please share your opinion to add to your argument.
  • RK
    Ron K.
    23 January 2021 @ 16:00
    There was not a wasted word in this interview. great questions and answers. Real informative.
  • KL
    K L.
    23 January 2021 @ 14:11
    i.e. not tether!????? Goodbye!
  • JB
    Jannis B.
    22 January 2021 @ 23:51
    What I like about Raoul compared to some of the other commentators at RV is that he really let's is guest talk and expand on their thouights without interruption. And of course great questions. Good work!
    • JB
      Jannis B.
      22 January 2021 @ 23:52
      *his (why no edit functionality?)
    • TP
      Timothy P.
      23 January 2021 @ 08:54
      Yeah, Raoul lets any guest say anything without a single erg of pushback. Just the kind of nod-along interviewing discerning investors need.
  • KP
    Kaushal P.
    23 January 2021 @ 05:27
    so much more useful and practical than internet losing their minds over Tether. "Man in the Arena" as Teddy would say.
  • DW
    Dean W.
    22 January 2021 @ 23:52
    Great insights. Interoperability is going to be hugely important. Will be fascinating to see how this all rolls out over the next few years.
  • HB
    Hariod B.
    22 January 2021 @ 19:55
    But this guy's only got 5 (five!) titles on his bookshelves, so what can he possibly know? Excellent, broad-ranging interview. Interviewee didn't much like the two tricky questions, though.
  • IB
    Iain B.
    22 January 2021 @ 17:17
    Hearing the words "USDC" and "Store of value" in the same sentence made me chuckle...
    • TP
      Timothy P.
      22 January 2021 @ 19:08
      Especially when one leg of that pegged currency is the US Dollar, which looks like it will be devalued to new records in 2021 and beyond. What's a few Trillion between friends, eh? lol
  • AM
    Aaron M.
    22 January 2021 @ 08:05
    Stable coins don't solve jurisdictional issues for remittance, to truly serve the global community you need a non sovereign bridge like XRP
    • TZ
      Toomas Z.
      22 January 2021 @ 12:50
      While that may be true, as said by David Schwartz/Brad several times, what becomes that bridge depends on liquidity/volume. It's difficult for BTC to do it as it hasn't got the TPS. Other projects are currently getting much more adoption for other things and thus generating more volume, while having high TPS or upgrades in the pipeline that will make it so. DOT can scale to 1M TPS with parachains. ETH will be able to scale to 100K TPS+ with ETH 2.0 and layer 2 solutions. Ripple had a great idea but bad strategy for executing it, as their only focus on cross border payments and no functioning smart contract platform meant no-one was building on XRP to generate volume from other sources to make payments easier. This may change with FLR, but it will be late 2021 by the time SPARK, dFLR etc. are functional platforms (yes they are released in Q2 2021 but that is just mainnet launch) with all required features, if not later (after all this, you also have to start generating volume for FXRP which takes even longer). I think they had a bad strategy for execution and as such were overtaken by other projects that will have the cross border payment problem solved simply by using stablecoins on top of other platforms by existing institutions, that will then compete for providin the lowest fees. They were also far too greedy with keeping 60% of the supply and selling it every month, causing the SEC to step in. I generally don't agree with how the SEC has done things here, but they do have a point that it's a little unfair on consumers when a single institution owns 60% of the supply of something and dumps on unsophisticated investors. Lets be honest, if you go on crypto twitter, the XRP shilling and riddlers suggest the IQ of a large group of these people is literally in the r*tarded region (Santiago Velez & some others excluded).
    • TP
      Timothy P.
      22 January 2021 @ 19:07
      Yeah, you need a centralized trashcan fire like XRP - which is getting delisted from major exchanges amid the SEC lawsuit. Your coin has a CEO. Your coin has a company. It will never succeed like decentralized coins will. Try to understand this, or enjoy staying poor.
  • TP
    Timothy P.
    22 January 2021 @ 19:02
    Circleguy tries to make the case where "FedCoin" won't succeed, but "CorpCoin" will. Its all the same pile of garbage - the moment you attempt to satisfy regulators, that is when you hitch your wagon to the failing legacy system. This is why exchanges and other on-ramps to Bitcoin are temporary at best -- the ultimate destination is pure crypto. Just funny to me, especially when Circle's coin has a 24 hour volume of 2.4 Billion, paltry when compared to Tether's 127 Billion. ( ) Sucking up to the legacy system may show short-term results, but longer-term you're on the wrong path with the wrong kind of solution. Thanks for the laughs, though.
  • RM
    Russell M.
    22 January 2021 @ 18:07
    Eye opening fantastic interview!
  • sd
    steve d.
    22 January 2021 @ 17:20
    Intelligent and informative content. Real Vision have already establish themselves as the leading providers of crypto content in the space. A real vision actualized.
  • MR
    Marco R.
    22 January 2021 @ 16:18
    Outstanding interview skills as always!
  • NC
    22 January 2021 @ 14:45
    I'd like to see Ed or Raoul interview somebody from Stripe.
  • SW
    Steve W.
    22 January 2021 @ 09:09
    Feel like I've grown up with Jeremy from the ColdFusion days. A real visionary, great to hear his thoughts - an optimistic future for sure.