The Next Phase of the Crypto Revolution

Published on
12 October, 2018
Financial System, Technology, Crypto-currencies
60 minutes
Asset class

The Next Phase of the Crypto Revolution

Featuring Mike Novogratz

Mike Novogratz of Galaxy Digital Capital Management joins Real Vision’s Raoul Pal for a deep dive into the world of crypto. The two heavyweights delve into the major opportunities and risks, discuss crypto’s influence on institutions, and predict what could be ahead for the space. Filmed on July 31, 2018 in New York.

Published on
12 October, 2018
Financial System, Technology, Crypto-currencies
60 minutes
Asset class


  • MC

    Michael C.

    16 10 2018 09:04

    2       0

    Fantastic interview. One of my favorites so far. Helpful to hear a fund manager talk about blockchain with out the breathlessness of a fanboy but as someone keen to make money in it.. Not sure I 1009% believe him (govt is going to want to get very involved the more successful/used it becomes) , but having 5% in bitcoin/blockchain starts to make more sense.

  • BB

    Bill B.

    15 10 2018 22:52

    0       0

    My guess is that semiconductors will do well. Crypto, AI, IoT, VR, AR, all need semiconductors to run.

  • SS

    Scuba S.

    15 10 2018 22:27

    2       0

    Anyone with Mike's ear that can ask him the supply cap on Ether? He probably has a few ins with their developers, this would be reliable insider information.

    I enjoy the Crypto® chats as they are useful for understanding how Wall Street is looking to make money off the space, but really miss the likes of Tuur Demeester or at least someone who can explain how this stuff works.

    As a side note, I suggest an interview with Elizabeth Stark on the workings of Lightning Network. Other viewers may want to learn about how Bitcoin is scaling and becoming faster before buying into the next Blockchain Token™.

  • RA

    Robert A.

    15 10 2018 18:40

    0       1

    Does anyone know how to invest in the BGCI index? It would be great to buy a basket of the top 12 Cryptos.

  • MC

    Mike C.

    15 10 2018 15:36

    1       0

    Great interview. Really appreciate the content on crypto. One of the main reasons I'm a subscriber. Please keep 'em coming!

  • B

    Brian .

    15 10 2018 14:58

    3       0

    This was filmed in July and posted in October? In a market moving as fast as cypto 3 months is an eternity.

  • JJ

    JJ J.

    15 10 2018 13:38

    4       0

    Thought the interview was going not too bad until I heard the comment that the esports industry will be bigger than real sports in 4-5 years. A quick trustee google search reveals in 2017 global eports industry was valued at nearly $493m, with forecast of $1.65b by 2020. And according to Forbes the value of all NFL teams in 2015 was $63b, MLB teams $36b, NBA teams $33b, NHL teams $15b. Let alone the actual industry value.... means esports needs to grow at a compound rate of about 315% over the next 5 years to almost equal the 2015 value of major US pro sports franchises. After investing Crypto I find the biggest problem is until they make it as easy to use as cash, it won't reach the mass adoption they expect.

  • PT

    Patrick T.

    15 10 2018 03:44

    7       0

    Makes sense. With student debt touching $2 trillion in three years, I suppose they will be buying virtual houses.

  • DG

    David G.

    15 10 2018 00:55

    10       0

    Is there a greater contrast in the world of investing than Mike Novogratz with Tony Deden?

    One talks crypto, tokens, VR, skins, blockchain, ICOs, venture and forks. The other talks participations, family-run owner-operated businesses, capital allocation, protecting savings and permanent irreplaceable capital.

    If your company 401k offered two plan options, Galaxy Digital Capital Management and Edelweiss Holdings Ltd, who would you entrust your hard-earned $ to?

  • SU

    Shakeel U.

    14 10 2018 22:35

    0       0


  • BM

    Beat M.

    14 10 2018 06:22

    3       1

    cognitive dissonance? revolution, but big players comming in?
    virtual reality in a breaking society?

    what about quantum computing? a gargantuan power only centralized power can have and one that can hack blockchain (so i heard...)

    what about the energy need of all those chains? it’s simply a given, no worries?

    and if the young get it 9x times faster, please interview one, i will listen to that interview 9x or more, until i get it.

  • TA

    Tobias A.

    14 10 2018 05:40

    4       0

    Great interview thanks for the content!
    Don't know where to suggest content however
    Would love to see Silvio Micali from MIT explain his Algorand project.
    They are doing the best job I have seen yet of bridging the gap between Finance and Crypto/Blockchain.
    Monetary policy, Daily dutch auctions, Forward curves etc.

  • EB

    Eric B.

    13 10 2018 23:27

    12       2

    Novogratz might want to have all those smart young guys that had to explain a 51% attack 9 times teach him what decentralized means in that context. When a group controls 51% or more of the mining they can pretty much do what they want including reversing old transactions or refusing to process new ones. Bitcoin ownership might be decentralized but mining's not. mining pool back in 2014 had more than 50% and voluntarily backed off, that's not decentralized where I come from. Repeating decentralized over and over when he must know miners run the show is nothing more than shameless promotion, completely disingenuous.

    To be a true store of value you have to be able to get your value back, unfortunately some crypto markets are run by scammers like MT. Gox and most probably Bitfinex. Does anyone believe people are buying billions of dollars worth of Tether tokens, supposedly backed 1.1 with dollars, from an exchange that cant maintain a banking relationship? People are reporting after months of trying to withdraw they finally got their wire transfer and it came from a construction company, lol.

    Hows that P.T. Barnum quote go again?

  • BA

    Bruno A.

    13 10 2018 16:05

    0       0

    We should have an interview with Brendan Miller and Dan Larimer of Block.One/EOS, one of Mike's investments. Block One with their 4 Bio USD war chest, and top notch investors, could really be a game changer and also an investment opportunity. EOS current market cap is 1/4 of ETH, yet is stability is way superior.

  • SS

    Sean S.

    13 10 2018 14:20

    1       0

    Great talk

  • MC

    Matthew C.

    13 10 2018 10:57

    3       0

    He has Evel Knievel's suit in his office !!

  • CS

    Christopher S.

    13 10 2018 10:47

    2       1

    "Bitcoin is not a transnational currency" what exactly is it's utility? Apart from being a speculation...

  • PG

    Petter G.

    13 10 2018 09:05

    5       1

    Great inverview. However, what I'd to hear from these crypto hedgefund guys is their view on security. Who and *why* would people pay money to secure these blockchains? Is there really enough room for more than one public blockchain globally from a security and cost perspective? The incentive structure is the most important part of the puzzle. Mull this through long enough and I bet you will come full circle and just buy bitcoin.

  • EP

    Eli P.

    13 10 2018 08:33

    8       6

    novogratz is pump and dump guy- i will not waste 1 second to hear him .bring on please the greatest investor ever -martin armstrong!!

  • SR

    Steve R.

    13 10 2018 08:07

    0       0

    Remember the movie Surrogates with Bruce Willis? Do we really want to end up in a world like that?

  • CC

    Chuma C.

    13 10 2018 02:51

    18       1

    The only problem is that this content is 3 months old. That’s a long time to sit on info on the fast-moving crypto-space.

  • VE

    Viktor E.

    12 10 2018 21:18

    10       0

    Great stuff and great energy! I don't see much value in any cryptocurrencies other then Bitcoin. The killer app for blockchain is money. Why would you for example buy and hold ethereums ether (with unreliable supply) and not just buy it when you would like to use it? You pay in "gas" to performe computation, like gas for a car there's no need to store any exsess amount. The value will be stored in the best store of value (..BTC)

    You are correct that Bitcoins base layer can't handle many transactions. That layer will probably be something like Fed funds, a settlement layer. The bulk of transactions will happen on layers built on top. You could add Visa/mastercard on top of Bitcoin today. But there's no demand for that right now (why spend Bitcoin when you still hold other, weaker currencies). Could also be trustless like lightning network.

    Improved liquidity is one of the most important things right now. Thanks real vision for bringing the subject to a more traditional investment crowd that could improve the liquidity.

  • KE

    Kathryn E.

    12 10 2018 21:11

    9       1

    I don't agree with this space not getting hit if there is a decent financial crash. I doubt institutions will be putting money in speculative spaces where everyone talks about the future but there isn't any real breakthrough yet, after having a decent correction in what it seems to be an everything bubble.

    I do think the technology will evolve, but not in the way a lot of these fellows hope

  • GS

    George S.

    12 10 2018 21:09

    5       0

    Brilliant interview and a lot to learn from someone who has actually made money in macro AND in crypto.

  • BP

    Bryce P.

    12 10 2018 19:07

    2       15

    AI / Crypto = PURE EVIL

  • RN

    Robert N.

    12 10 2018 18:59

    3       7

    If you want 1 hour 48 minutes of "expert" testimony on these matters, here is a link to the Senate Banking Committee hearing on "Exploring the Cryptocurrency and Blockchain Ecosystem." This was streamed on 11 October. Roubini has been under sustained attack on social media since the hearing.

  • RN

    Robert N.

    12 10 2018 18:50

    1       3

    I watched the US senate review where one of the experts brought in was Nouriel Roubini. I also read his deposition and the deposition of the crypto advocate. Roubini, Kaminska, Rickards, and other well-known commentators have really stepped up their attacks. Just scroll back through Roubini's twitter feed. Here is an extract without the expletives currently peppering the feed.
    These crypto lunatics know nothing about money, banking finance , monetary policy. They have zero financial literacy. And they pretend to reinvent money. A solution to a problem that doesn't exist. And a solution that is the return to the Stone Age of barter
    Stumbling into some crypto journalism this evening meanwhile reminds me how massively uninformed about financial structures and history most of these “practitioners” are. The stablecoin stuff is particularly enraging.
    There used to be an old (mafia-themed) adage that when nobody was prepared to bank your illicit cash, you simply bought the bank. This apparently has gone over the heads of regulators who today are cheering start-up banks who champion crypto services.
    Not endorsing their views but it makes for an interesting read especially his attacks on Ethereum and the much vaunted decentralisation.

  • DH

    Daniel H.

    12 10 2018 18:21

    13       2

    I worked in computing and I know what a blockchain is. I did not hear one thing that gave me more comfort that crypto is anything more than a repeat of the AI bubble that ran from 1985 to 1995. A lot of money spent, but no killer app. They talked about "use cases" and "this space", like good techno geeks, but what is that killer app and its use case? All I heard was infrastructure and virtual gaming.

  • ZH

    Zayd H.

    12 10 2018 17:45

    3       9

    Hey RV - Can we get a Nouriel v. Novogratz debate? Nouriel has destroyed everybody so far...figure Novogratz would be a more fair fight.

  • TH

    Timo H.

    12 10 2018 17:25

    6       2

    Mike should have better tech advisors. For example his views about ethereum are "a bit" naive and probably heavily influenced by semi-blind believers.

  • fc

    frank c.

    12 10 2018 17:24

    2       0

    waiting for RVTV to do some work on ..... well ahead of the curve

  • BA

    Benjamin A.

    12 10 2018 17:18

    6       0

    I really enjoy the Crypto focused content. Keep it up! I think Mike Novogratz has a lot of things right and also a lot of things wrong. Directionally, I think Mike is spot on about crypto being the future. The human capital going into crypto is quite bullish along with bullish sentiment in the venture community. I like Mikes macro thoughts about crypto but I feel he really lacks the technical knowledge to understand the many moving components of the space. Like for example, he continues to talk about Etherium being decentralized. I think Etherium is an interesting project but can you really say that Etherium is decentralized when an average user cannot run a full node? (the size of the ledger is so large, and the bandwidth requirements are so high that most of the nodes are being run by server farms). The nodes are the ones verifying the ledger and making sure all the market participants are following the rules. If they are all being run by a select few companies then the control of the Etherium blockchain is within the hands of a few companies and therefore not that decentralized. If its not decentralized, what is the value prop? a centralized database would have far better performance than a blockchain.

    Honestly though, I think Mike is very influential in getting some of the real capital (institutions) involved and probably has a great feel about what the sentiment is among institutional investors.

  • TJ

    Terry J.

    12 10 2018 15:07

    5       3

    Typical RVTV! Ahead of the curve again! Just when most of us, well me and most people I know anyway had written the epitaph for cryptos, RVTV jolts me into realising just how wrong we have been. Another outstanding video full of excellent investment knowledge, and guidance. Thank you!

  • NG

    Nick G.

    12 10 2018 14:53

    9       3

    Come and peddle that stuff to me when it's trading above the 200MA and it is positively sloped. Until then...I would not touch it with your money.

  • FC

    Fractal C.

    12 10 2018 14:30

    4       0

    Very interesting indeed. Interesting that there is tons of bullish smart money activities happening beneath the surface in the crypto space . Also, interesting how Mike thinks about ownership driven data companies - significant point of view in my opinion.

  • JB

    Jason B.

    12 10 2018 13:24

    3       1

    Awesome interview. It sounds like for non-accredited / sophisticated investors, buying crypto or looking at some of the index funds is one good route. I wonder at what point we will be able to use the ethereum blockchain to create more sophisticated structures that will be available? (Mike Green, when he spoke to Pantera, explained how through Augur one could have created the MBS to short it back in 2008.)

  • YW

    Yowshi W.

    12 10 2018 13:12

    3       4

    This is the future. It will pay to learn about this stuff IMO.

  • JN

    Jack N.

    12 10 2018 12:51

    8       4

    Never heard anyone use more words and say less. Six months ago he was talking about the inevitable herds.

  • CD

    Clive D.

    12 10 2018 12:45

    2       0

    Nice to hear some direction on crypto from an insider. Thank you RV

  • HU

    Henry U.

    12 10 2018 12:40

    1       2

    - Novo intiated his ETH position as speculative position then he went ahead to figure out what it really was ( nothing wrong with that, smart move)
    - Wish the interview touched more on the bank consortiums ( Corda, Quorum form JPM) and where this space it going.
    - "eSports will be a huge market" - imho totally agree but if there is an exchange for trading the "skins" and taking a fee there is still a middle man!! How is that decentralize?
    - Security Tokens, would like to know how or when it will start changing the financial pipeline. There are several players already. Digital Asset Group ( Blythe Masters), Axoni, tZero ( god know if there are really doing anything tangible)

    Overall glad to see Novo again.

  • NS

    Nathan S.

    12 10 2018 10:17

    5       0

    HODL meme isn’t “hold on for dear life”...

  • PJ

    Peter J.

    12 10 2018 09:19

    13       16

    It is only my opinion and I suspect I will get a lot of disagreement here, but IMO the Crypto space is getting a higher level of coverage on RVTV than its 'Current' importance and validity merits.