The Rise of Bitcoin – Mark Hart

Published on
June 9th, 2017
Topic
Crypto-currencies, China, Macro
Duration
59 minutes
Asset class
Equities, Currencies, Crypto-currencies

The Rise of Bitcoin – Mark Hart

The Interview ·
Featuring Mark Hart

Published on: June 9th, 2017 • Duration: 59 minutes • Asset Class: Equities, Currencies, Crypto-currencies • Topic: Crypto-currencies, China, Macro

Mark Hart is one of the biggest thinkers around in the macro world and as he debates the pros and cons of Bitcoin with Raoul Pal, understand how hedge funds are approaching the cryptocurrency revolution. In a fast paced interview, the investing icon also zeros in on what’s getting him excited in global circles, from bombed out Greek assets to the burgeoning and soon to be legal markets in North America for marijuana. Filmed on May 23, 2017, in Orlando.

Comments

  • MS
    Marvin S.
    17 January 2018 @ 22:53
    Good Job Mark! I am a very happy shareholder of Mark's fund. Worth and Mark are smart. Pay attention all. MK
  • BK
    Brian K.
    20 December 2017 @ 21:00
    Please have Mark on quarterly
  • JV
    Jens V.
    14 November 2017 @ 13:10
    Brilliant! Lots of great ideas and perspectives. True that Bitcoin is useful for large transfers - and there isn't a good alternative for that cross borders. And in most countries not within borders either. Mark is definitely a great thinker and an original mind, and Raoul did a great job as always. Thanks.
  • BK
    Brian K.
    31 October 2017 @ 16:38
    Will we look back at bitcoins valuation as a mania ? Probably, but its real if you cash out prior to the implosion.
  • AK
    Alexander K.
    22 August 2017 @ 22:27
    Very cool interview Raoul. Mark seems such a chilled guy.
  • JS
    John S.
    10 August 2017 @ 23:35
    Mark seems like a great and brilliant guy. I really enjoyed it.
  • SW
    Steven W.
    26 July 2017 @ 12:18
    No Mark, we have ransomware because of bitcoin. The anonymous international payment is what has spurred ransomware and other frauds.
  • MS
    Mark S.
    16 June 2017 @ 05:20
    I like Mark Hart, but I am Canadian, Justin Trudeau is an idiot!!! He's got no education relevant to his post. The only reason he got the job is because of his last name.
    • GH
      Gloria H.
      17 June 2017 @ 18:15
      Could say that about another North American leader...
  • TC
    Thomas C.
    14 June 2017 @ 11:59
    Brilliant - just brilliant !!
  • PR
    Peter R.
    14 June 2017 @ 04:27
    I have a hard time accepting bitcoin as a store of value. To me a store of value is something that can be easily measured and recognised i.e. Gold, Silver, diamonds, property, patents etc. Their value should be relatively stable and retain their real value over time. Bitcoin is more like a lottery ticket or electronic pixy dust. Couple that with low transaction speeds at ever higher costs. Sorry Mark, to me it looks like a future train wreck.
    • DR
      Daniel R.
      18 June 2017 @ 20:08
      Bitcoin (BTC) has many of the same good properties as gold. In fact it is easier to hold (securely without counterparty risk), transport, divide, verify, transfer. I can buy BTC from a stranger without a trusted broker and be 100% confident that it is truly BTC. Regarding volatility there's a circularity. If it gets to gold or currency like acceptability it has to increase in value manifold. That is volatility (and we know nothing goes up in a straight line). Mr Hart's 'wall of worry' argument is powerful. Consensus is that it's a bubble - I'll take the other side.
  • AS
    Adam S.
    13 June 2017 @ 19:01
    Have had long Cannabis view for a long time now but boss won't bite (still a junior) what do people think of: $ACB, $APH, $WEED, $ZYNE, & $BLO ?
  • KE
    Kenan E.
    13 June 2017 @ 16:24
    I think Bitcoin was nice to develop the blockchain-technology. But it will fail because of the monopolization issue. It is also completely corrrect to do the development as open source. BUT a working digital currency has to ensure that the mining / driving of the network is done by a huge number of nodes (why not every (coin)-network participant?) so it is practically not manipulatable. So why not develop a digital currency where every participant HAS TO provide a little computing power to do the "mining"? I think that would actually work. Different miners in the past already got over 50% of the "mining-power". I think that proves that bitcoin ALREADY failed. If there is an attack-vector it has to be eliminated. I currently do not see how this could happen with bitcoin.
    • MR
      Marc R.
      13 November 2018 @ 01:17
      in Satoshi's white paper he addresses why 1 cpu as one vote would be worse for governance. it is because bot networks are easy to assemble so one entity can amass the votes of all zombie computers they hack. using a specific algorithm means that one must invest in specific mining hardware to participate in the network, satoshi predicted first GPUs and then maybe something similar to the asics of today. If you have to buy special computers you are invested in bitcoin and not motivated financially to destroy bitcoin. If I controlled 50% of hashing power I would just mine normally. Why attempt a double spend? the most it nets me is a few million in coin that I can double spend via a vendor, even if they sold me a bugatti (unlikely as its a large purchase) but I destroy the value of the 100 billion dollar network and my asic miners, I spent billions on, which can only mine bitcoin or any SHA 256 coin. IMO even with a majority hash rate one would not be motivated to attack the network. Or at least not be self-interested to do so.
  • KE
    Kenan E.
    13 June 2017 @ 15:57
    OK guys -- we know how many bitcoins will be around in x years... BUT ONLY if no one changes the code! THAT's ONE the problem with crypto-currencies. Another is the monopolization of mining (aka driving the network) as seen . If there are only a handful of miners you get a REAL problem. This only works if there are a lot of different small entitities who conduct the mining otherwise it simply fails (aka can be manipulated by the guys who have the monopoly).
    • DR
      Daniel R.
      18 June 2017 @ 20:31
      In theory anything can happen - but as investors or speculators we play probabilities. True, mining is not as distributed as we'd like. But it's hard to imagine the miners acting against their self interest. I met some of the top miners in China last year and they're keeping as much BTC as they can because they believe in it. And in any reasonable scenario, there'll be a substantive version of BTC that honors the existing set of inflation rules. I think that will be the dominant chain, but even if not there is still substantial value. The hash power (think of castle walls as an analogy) of the bitcoin network is so insanely high - orders of magnitude higher than Ethereum, the next biggest cryptocurrency - that a forked chain with some fraction of that hash power is still pretty damned secure.
    • PN
      Paul N.
      28 June 2017 @ 12:44
      Networks are voluntary systems. Nobody can force a change in the code because that requires everyone else updating to that version. And as the network grows it becomes harder and harder to change. Try changing http or the qwerty keyboard. Not going to happen. Mining centralization will likely abate over time as more competitors enter the space and advancements slow down. Mining chips are already hitting 16nm physical limits giving smaller miners time to catch up.
  • TA
    Tobias A.
    13 June 2017 @ 12:34
    I have suddenly become aware of the geopolitical game theory involves in which countries ban and or embrace crypto. My conclusion is essentially that it is a very risky move to clamp down on them as on a global competitiveness stance you could be shutting yourself out of the new economy somewhat. And by embracing them as a secondary currency like Japan has done, this could essentially allow you to debase your currency on a more aggressive basis as the people would have an outlet to use to protect value while at the same time giving yourself a competitive advantage in world trade. Does anyone else have any similar thoughts on this?
  • RM
    Russell M.
    13 June 2017 @ 02:52
    why couldn't gov regulate tax and fee bitcoin?
  • RM
    Russell M.
    13 June 2017 @ 02:51
    Why couldn't government impose regulation and transaction fees
  • BK
    Bruce K.
    12 June 2017 @ 16:10
    It would be more than a bit scary if we relied on economic game theory to secure a blockchain. ;-) The blockchain is secured by strong public key cryptography. Owning a keypair (specifically the PRIVATE key) may represent a cryptocurrency token, or it may represent something else entirely. In the case of BTC, yes, ownership of a private key *is* ownership of the associated BTC. And we already have commercial blockchains where the private keys are NOT associated with a cryptocurrency at all.
    • PN
      Paul N.
      13 June 2017 @ 09:51
      That is false. The keypair secures your individual wallet, not the blockchain database itself. The blockchain is secured by the cumulative computing power of miners who are incentivized using the token reward. Scary or not that's exactly how the blockchain is secured. Public key cryptography does not make a blockchain. It is one of several technologies that it uses and has existed for nearly four decades. The actual bitcoin whitepaper focuses 75% on proof of work and mining. These commercial blockchains are simply reinventing the wheel and calling it innovation.
  • XZ
    Xriva Z.
    12 June 2017 @ 13:48
    IMHO, taking any kind of drugs is stupid and self destructive, not a 'healthy lifestyle.' In any case, I support the legalization of all drugs (and prostitution) because it would be safer and take the $ away from the criminals . . . though some of the $ would go to the grey criminals (government.) Plus my tax dollars would not be spent fighting drug crime.
    • JD
      Jakk D.
      12 June 2017 @ 22:12
      You must not eat chocolate or drink coffee/tea either. Caffine is a drug too. So much BS labeling over the years has really planted some flags in people minds.
    • AC
      Andy C.
      15 June 2017 @ 16:24
      We are here to look at trends and be open minded for opportunities, not to advocate our personal opinions and beliefs. I am glad RV is open to all opinions and thank you for this video.
  • FH
    Faisal H.
    12 June 2017 @ 11:26
    I loved this! Such quality content, I've found great value from this!
  • SB
    Sam B.
    12 June 2017 @ 01:12
    Broadly speaking, millennials don't have enough income or net worth to raise kids or buy houses...at least not until there has been serious deflation. I have a ton of respect for Mark and I consider all his interviews to be extremely thought provoking. I just think its strange how he's now double fisting the bullish kool-aid. The biggest disagreement I have with him here is that I believe he's investing far too much confidence in governments executing successfully... with regard to both the nebulous Trump agenda and in the Chinese and the rest of the world keeping the eurodollar system intact for anything longer than just the short-term. Whatever the mysterious Shanghai Accord actually was, I highly doubt it will prove to be a durable solution...
    • EO
      Emil O.
      12 June 2017 @ 09:31
      agree, the minimalist millenial is the result of a generation being priced out of markets i.e. economic realities created the behavior and not the other way around..
  • sv
    scot v.
    12 June 2017 @ 00:33
    Is cryptocurrency decreasing the demand for Gold and Silver?
  • rs
    richard s.
    11 June 2017 @ 21:39
    Couple of comments/ questions that maybe someone could explain to me. 1. I do not understand why the coins them selves should have any real value. As I understand it the coins can be bought and sold it divided pieces, So cant they be divided infinitely. Thus there is no real value cause the supply is in fact infinite not Finite. 2. Should the Coins become any real competition for currencies such as the USD, why wouldn't institutions like the FED hammer the price by selling large quantities as is said to happen with gold. For all practical purposes the Federal Reserve has infinite credit at its disposal so it could simply short bitcoin at will, or any other coin APP
    • PN
      Paul N.
      11 June 2017 @ 23:44
      Gold bars can be divided into trillions of atoms. Does that make its supply near infinite? Pumping infinite credit to short a particular asset is asinine and will only make that credit worthless in the long term. It isnt happening nor will it happen. And if it did it wouldnt work long term.
  • BK
    Bruce K.
    11 June 2017 @ 21:21
  • BK
    Bruce K.
    11 June 2017 @ 21:21
  • BK
    Bruce K.
    11 June 2017 @ 20:41
    A little clarification may be in order. The blockchain technology underlying cyber-currencies is open source software. Like Linux. As a matter of fact, one of the most robust blockchain platforms called Hyperledger is being developed under the auspices of the Linux foundation. Point #1 being, this super-interesting technology with tremendous potential applications is FREE. Raoul made a comment along those lines, so I wanted to add this clarifying explanation. Point #2 being, excitement around cyber-currencies bas NOTHING to do with the aforementioned "tremendous potential applications." Trade settlement? Supply chain assurance? Anti-counterfeiting protection? All great ideas that can benefit from blockchain technology ... but these applications have ZERO connection to Bitcoin, Ether, or any of the other 500 crypto-currencies. Summary: blockchain technology is now separate and distinct from crypto-currencies. Hope that makes sense.
    • rs
      richard s.
      11 June 2017 @ 21:27
      Thank you , so what are the functions of Bitcoin and the other app coins and does a rising price make any real sense? Thanks
    • PN
      Paul N.
      11 June 2017 @ 23:38
      The cryptocurrency token is a necessary part of the economic game theory that keeps the blockchain secure. They are not separate.
    • BK
      Bruce K.
      12 June 2017 @ 16:03
      What is the function of Bitcoin, et al? Mark does a good job of outlining the roles: store of value, etc. You can reach your own conclusion on prices based on how you feel about the utility value that BTC delivers.
  • MS
    Matt S.
    11 June 2017 @ 17:10
    That was fucking awesome. sorry..... ;p
  • DE
    Donald E.
    11 June 2017 @ 15:48
    I think the point on China vs Japan savings financing OBOR is misleading at best / incorrect. Chinese Savings (49% of GDP)/ deposits in the Chinese banking system finance the offshore investment into OBOR (not Japanese savers investing in CNY bonds). A portion comes from the vast FX reserves from CIC / MOF / PBOC / AIIB which have directly financed funds specifically for OBOR (eg The silk road fund) . Banks & wealth management products (shadow banking) are THE core "buyers" of China's local denominated debts. In addition the 4 core policy banks lead by China Development Bank lend at the project level in large scale projects where China has an "edge" 1) Rail 2) highways / infrastructure 3) power / power distribution (state grid, CNOOC / Sinopec in oil) 4) technology e.g. mobile masts / Huawei......the impact is clearly visible in Sri Lanka, SE Asia, Pakistan, Mongolia, Kazakhstan / Central Asia, Africa amongst other countries..... A great product RVTV thank you
  • LW
    Landon W.
    11 June 2017 @ 13:20
    I have a problem with the narrative of deregulation being the reason for the market rally. Everyday, Trump's approval ratings are falling. The risk of a major political reversal seems high in 2018 and 2000. Are the odds not increasing that we see the Elizabeth Warren faction takeover and all of potential market drivers become major headwinds? Shouldn't the market begin discounting this risk? It sure doesn't seem like Trump is going to accomplish much of his agenda.
    • DR
      David R.
      11 June 2017 @ 19:12
      Agreed, and this is why Asian and Chinese markets are on fire this year and will continue to hugely outperform US markets over the next decade-plus.
  • TS
    Thomas S.
    11 June 2017 @ 02:28
    I think Worth Wray called it correctly. The Shanghi Accord. It shows how governments and CBs are willing to do things under the table
  • TR
    Thomas R.
    11 June 2017 @ 00:20
    The one question or hurdle in my mind about Bit Coin or digital currencies and their viability at scale as a “currency” and specifically a medium of exchange, is a Government’s need to tax. Up until now all in-country use of all government currencies don’t, by their use, create a taxable transaction. Yes trading FX currencies against one another creates taxable gains and losses – but the simple every day use of a gov’t currency to buy stuff does not. I.E. If I’m in the US and want to buy a television in the US with US dollars I have in my wallet – my purchase does not create a taxable transaction for me, the buyer. Staying with the US - in the US Bit Coin is treated as a commodity for tax purposes. Currently if I have accumulated and own bit coins and I use bit coin to buy a Television – I’ve created a taxable transaction on the built up gain in my Bit Coins on its value realization in buying a TV. Multiply this transaction at scale and you create a taxation nightmare. In my question, I am implying that there is an element of control a gov’t has over its currency and managing it – especially if we go to the elimination of cash and go to digital currency. How does bitcoin or any other non-gov’t based digital currency effectively get recognized as a currency for purposes of being a medium of exchange? Once digital currencies get to a certain scale of use (way beyond the $70 billion they all cumulative represent world-wide now) what prevents governments from adopting their own digital currency and prohibit the use of non-gov’t digital currencies? Said probation could come about, perhaps by law, but from my perspective, the more practical prohibition may likely come in the form of the imposition of taxation rules and regulations on non-Gov’t digital currencies. I’ve thought about this same argument for gold – as gold is also deemed a commodity for tax purposes - except gold is and has been recognized as a currency worldwide and, as it is now from a practical and use perspective, the future of gold is not likely to have a primary use as a medium of exchange – but more likely to have the role of backstopping the valuation of government currency going forward. I would also assert that the current use of gold is more as a storer of value that a medium of exchange or unit of account. Thanks RV
  • MT
    Michael T.
    10 June 2017 @ 22:59
    Wow. What a cool interview. It was super refreshing to hear good arguments that contradict the current narrative.
  • MC
    Mike C.
    10 June 2017 @ 20:06
    Will add....Mark starting to talk like a tech. VC...important shift in thinking/interpreting what is happening in our economy.This is one of the shifts folks....constant efficiency is a net positive to wealth creation/growth but they may not appear so bullish on traditional metrics. Step back, have a broad look at what's going on folks. Don't let the FUD break you down.
  • MC
    Mike C.
    10 June 2017 @ 19:47
    Being involved in Bitcoin for 4 years now, what I see is that you either get it or you don't....I witnessed the exact same transformation happening in the early internet days. Takes time for people to understand ubiquitous decentralized distributed systems because we've all been brainwashed to believe we need a keeper and gates. Mark understand the new age phenomena.....if you can't see this paradigm shift, it will/is happening without you!!
    • rs
      richard s.
      11 June 2017 @ 21:32
      I totally get that aspect of block chains, makes perfect sense what does not make sense is why there should be any price rise at all, even thought there is a limited supply of coins they can be divided infinitely. thus making them infinite in reality.
    • MZ
      Michael Z.
      12 June 2017 @ 02:09
      they can't be divided infinitely....i believe a bitcoin can be broken into one hundred million pieces....and that unit level is known as a satoshi....not 100%, but they aren't infinite.
    • JV
      Jonas V.
      12 June 2017 @ 03:49
      Even if they could be divided infinitely that wouldn't be a problem. If they can be divided into a billion pieces that still would be a billionth of 1 bitcoin. It's like a share split, a company can split its shares all it wants the total number of shares still represents the same company.
  • DL
    Douglas L.
    10 June 2017 @ 17:53
    Great conversation between Raoul and Mark. If you listened to the recent Real Vision podcast, you'll note that Raoul closed out his Bitcoin trade after three years. Raoul mentioned that he experienc
    • DL
      Douglas L.
      10 June 2017 @ 18:07
      ...experienced a 50% drawdown. I'm sure it was still a good trade for him. Many crypto currencies are scams. Investigate ETH...some potential problems there.
  • AH
    Andreas H.
    10 June 2017 @ 17:50
    I slept a night over that interview. Bitcoins: this was filmed in may, so he was right there is going to be a run! Further more he is substantially bullish on other themes (Greek stock market, housing, Biotec) and he was very bearish a year ago on a lot of things (China). He has shifted his opinion and I like that flexibility a lot. Good views on demographics too. A lot of others have turned bullish (and bearish on gold, Peter Brand and others...), so I start to wonder how long this will work, 2-3 Years and the pain trade (which is still up!) might be over, everybody is then in the market(s) and things turn around... Bitcoins are a beast, I got out of them a week ago with a 650% gain, I know I will regret it, not having the stomach to ride them a bit more...
  • AS
    Andrew S.
    10 June 2017 @ 15:08
    Newsflash: You can own both gold and Bitcoin.
  • JM
    James M.
    10 June 2017 @ 14:39
    Be grateful if anyone can answer one question. May be naive but I put it out there anyway. CBs have used seemingly infinite (Of course we can argue if it is or not) fiat to buy public assets best example being SNB and BOJ buying Apple and Japanese ETFs. Whats to stop them doing the same with any digital currency at any price and therefore controlling the instrument?
    • MS
      Matt S.
      11 June 2017 @ 17:27
      good question - some even question who the mysterious "Satoshi Nakamoto" was who supposedly wrote the blockchain paper. Possibly written years ago by the Pentagon / Fed for all we know.
  • SR
    Steve R.
    10 June 2017 @ 09:07
    So Mark's thesis for an increasing bitcoin price is because of FOMO! Because a fisherman in Zimbabwe can earn more in a day buying bitcoin than in a month selling fish. WTF! Are you serious? Sounds like a pyramid scheme to me. Funny how everyone I know in the bitcoin space is mega hyper-bullish, see no negatives at all, nothing. But that's because they all have a vested interest in keeping the hype going long enough for them to get their money out before all those late to the party get wiped out! I have total respect for Mark, but I feel he's been brainwashed by the bitcoin cryptomainacs. Their whole thesis is based on pure greed. Its just like 'investment extremism'!
    • KS
      Kim S.
      10 June 2017 @ 14:27
      I think he fully admits it's a pyramid scheme, but expects it to be global. Thus lots of time to get in? Not my kind of speculation but I can see the possibility.
    • PN
      Paul N.
      11 June 2017 @ 23:47
      Bitcoin will go up because it is scarce & useful, and becoming more useful every day. Mark's fomo idea will simply create a boom bust cycle within the broader trend.
  • JV
    Jonas V.
    10 June 2017 @ 08:08
    For what it's worth, I own gold but never used it to circumvent capital controls. I have used bitcoin though for that purpose. Wiring money to Brazil takes days and you need to physically go to the bank to sign paperwork if it's more than $2000. Plus you pay a financial transaction tax. No need for any of that with bitcoin! Other blockchains, gold, some initiative in India... aren't going to resolve my problems.
  • NS
    Nathan S.
    10 June 2017 @ 04:41
    Thanks Mark and Raoul, great discussion. Very timely regarding Bitcoin. One (hopefully helpful) comment for Mark regarding deductibility of business expenses for US cannabis companies (ie. s 280E issue), the bigger companies can and do structure around this.
  • RA
    Robert A.
    10 June 2017 @ 03:32
    Great job Raoul. Mark seems "easy" to interview until....he's not. I'd listen to ANYTHING he has to say---is there a house for sale between your two! Raoul, when did you learn to interview in the "suspense novel" style....has Mark covered his massive Yuan devaluation bet yet??...and what about Kyle??...Very cheeky, your leaving us hanging! IMO, seems clear he has smaller sized, been stopped out, or has exited the position. Thanks for getting Mark on as not many would ever have this kind of access to him w/o a chance meeting in the martial arts studio!
  • BS
    Brandon S.
    10 June 2017 @ 00:47
    The first millennials are early 30's. Lots of people waiting till mid to late 30's to have kids. They'll all be looking to move into housing at the same time.
    • VK
      Vladimir K.
      10 June 2017 @ 02:03
      As a millennial in my early 30's I will wait for the world crisis to buy an apartment in North America. :)
  • CM
    Chris M.
    9 June 2017 @ 23:40
    You should own bitcoin so you can pay off ransomware and that it is climbing a wall of worry. This is a persuasive argument.
  • CM
    Chris M.
    9 June 2017 @ 23:37
    I am only 20 minutes in, but hearing some of the weakest arguments for buying an asset in Bitcoin. Tulip bulbs were one time a storage of value. Agree with earlier post, much better holding gold if storage of value is your key need. He even admits that it is in a tulip bubble.
  • FC
    Fractal C.
    9 June 2017 @ 22:50
    Whoa!
  • KS
    Kim S.
    9 June 2017 @ 22:22
    I especially like the Greek/Cyprus ideas considering China's potential interest in that area. Any funds for a retail investor to enter?
    • VK
      Vladimir K.
      10 June 2017 @ 01:58
      For Greece - GREK ETF. Cyprus - I don't know.
  • AH
    Andreas H.
    9 June 2017 @ 21:14
    Great Interview!
    • AH
      Andreas H.
      9 June 2017 @ 21:15
      Super, one of the best!!!
    • AH
      Andreas H.
      9 June 2017 @ 21:56
      Super, super, super!!!
  • HJ
    Harry J.
    9 June 2017 @ 20:56
    Bit coin = third party risk. I'll take gold every time!
    • JV
      Jonas V.
      10 June 2017 @ 07:50
      Excuse me? No third party risk at all if you store it correctly, just as with gold.
    • TM
      The-First-James M.
      10 June 2017 @ 11:11
      Trezor...
  • MM
    Michael M.
    9 June 2017 @ 20:52
    Re: cannabis, mark is perhaps missing that generation z/homelanders are the most conservative generation for maybe a century.
    • MM
      Michael M.
      9 June 2017 @ 21:01
      just got to the bit where he talks about millenials, the guy is a kind of genius. Hadn't thought of this view of delayed adulthood in this way at all. Superb interview.
  • GD
    Gustavo D.
    9 June 2017 @ 20:33
    This video made me think. The one thing bitcoin adds to this world that no asset has is security in usage without the need of trust, from anyone. I like gold, but i find it difficult to believe that there is no influence on its price from governing bodies or large entities. Corporations may not want to use bitcoin, but I know a lot of people who do.
    • GD
      Gustavo D.
      9 June 2017 @ 20:37
      Forgot to mention, the same reason it looks to be failing with the scaling debate, is the same reason i think its succeeding...Okay ill stop cheerleading.
    • VK
      Vladimir K.
      10 June 2017 @ 01:54
      Of course, government doesn't want you to own gold, look at all the transaction costs of buying and holding it. Or think about the situation which is not so unrealistic. Let's say you "mined" gold in your backyard. just found a piece of gold. if you try to google where to sell it, you will be faced with police undercover trying to buy it. Couse it is illegal. All these side factors decrease the value of gold.
    • TM
      The-First-James M.
      10 June 2017 @ 11:13
      That's why it's sensible to use a VPN and to not use google. I find DuckDuckGo satisfies 99% of my searches. Cheers.
    • MK
      Misty K.
      12 June 2017 @ 01:14
      Vladimir, I do not know where in the world you are located but in the U.S.A it is not illegal to buy or sell gold.
  • MA
    Matt A.
    9 June 2017 @ 19:57
    As a millennial myself, I really appreciate Mark and Raoul's openness to discuss such trending topics like cannabis, bitcoin, and the young generation of renters and soon to be home owners. I agree mostly with everything said on cannabis. As bullish as Mark sounded on it, I think he's even underestimating the potential of legalization in the US. Not only is it a commodity, but also an ingredient in everything from medical remedies to bath and beauty products. Also, it has a user-base already built in. When it's legalized, look out!
  • EL
    Elizabeth L.
    9 June 2017 @ 18:59
    Absolutely great discussion. If at all possible, having Mark back at least twice a year would be great. Would of course love hearing him on a quarterly basis. His way of thinking is unique and he has the ability to see things from 30,000 feet up to take in the whole picture. I don't mind the moving around the world style discussion Thank you Mark. Thank you Raoul.
  • PH
    Philip H.
    9 June 2017 @ 17:19
    I totally agree that Medical Marijuana and adult use are going grow hugely over next few years. I currentlly own Canadian Bioceutical Corp. They are pursuing a "roll up" stategy in US excuse the pun!!
  • DR
    De R.
    9 June 2017 @ 17:12
    how about china over levered banking sector. @.@
  • TJ
    Terry J.
    9 June 2017 @ 16:47
    Wow! Listening to Mark, maybe it is "Morning in Amercia" again! Brilliant exchange of views from two macro giants whom I could listen to all day. I especially enjoyed listening to the discussion on bitcoin and cannabis, where the potential is enoprmous. It was Raoul who first got me interested in bitcoin and now hearing Mark waxing so positively on the cryptocurrency suggests to me we are still at the early end of the phenomenal potential it has to offer. Obviously nobody should bet the ranch, but as Raoul originally suggested a small speculation could eventually yield a very handsome dividend. Awesome insights!
    • MS
      Matt S.
      11 June 2017 @ 17:18
      Raoul has already sold all his Bitcoin.
  • RA
    Ricardo A.
    9 June 2017 @ 16:36
    Still incredibly smart, but I've seen a sharper M.Hale in the past ...
  • BE
    Baha E.
    9 June 2017 @ 16:13
    Mark is brilliant but he was wrong about China devalue. People can naturally be wrong.
  • TM
    The-First-James M.
    9 June 2017 @ 16:03
    Absolutely awesome. I'd forgotten how much value for money an hour long sit down with Mark Hart can provide to Realvision Subscribers! You are killing it this week Gents!
  • WB
    Wes B.
    9 June 2017 @ 15:24
    90 min interviews would be fine with me. Just sayin'
  • A1
    Animal 1.
    9 June 2017 @ 15:23
    Great!
  • AA
    Ali A.
    9 June 2017 @ 15:17
    ... that determines intrinsic value
  • AA
    Ali A.
    9 June 2017 @ 15:16
    If a corporate owned a patent for blockchain technology then that would be what youd want to own. Anyone can create a blockchain nowadays, and there is nothig other than confidence and critical mass t
  • MB
    Michael B.
    9 June 2017 @ 15:02
    Honey Badger dont give a shit
  • JV
    JACK V.
    9 June 2017 @ 14:47
    2 global macro legends devoting so much time to discussing Bitcoin and Canadian Weed speaks volumes about the (manipulated) state of major markets and the difficulties of divining high conviction trade ideas (in stocks, bonds, fx, commodities) in this age of central bank interventionism.
  • DF
    Dominic F.
    9 June 2017 @ 14:11
    These guys have total respect for each other because they totally challenge each other, think differently and feed each others thought processes. Great to watch in itself whatever the subject matter.
  • VK
    Viresh K.
    9 June 2017 @ 13:14
    Wow, at the OBOR section... Mark is still the smartest guy in the room
  • VK
    Viresh K.
    9 June 2017 @ 13:14
    Wow, at the OBOR section... Mark is still the smartest guy in the room
  • T~
    Tshort63 ~.
    9 June 2017 @ 13:12
    Great debate. Never been a fan of Bitcoin as technology eats itself. Xcite, LexusNexus, @home, Yahoo, Bing, Google, and n+ etc. Combining tech and currency is a disaster waiting to happen. More akin to the tulip than to a store of value. Just my $.02. I hold physical gold. If God forbid, a kinetic war breaks out and technology is shut down by hackers or by EMP then having bitcoin will not help buy a gallon of gas where gold and silver will.
    • KA
      Kevin A.
      9 June 2017 @ 20:02
      Suggest watching Art Cashin interview. When the rockets are flying, you buy them. You don't sell them.
    • VK
      Vladimir K.
      10 June 2017 @ 01:40
      On a value of gold in kinetic war - initially, I had the same reasoning, but then - if it happens I won't care if I am rich or not, the probability of survival in this scenario is minimum. Therefore, Bitcoin can still represent Gold 2.0.
    • UK
      Uros K.
      10 June 2017 @ 05:51
      If you're worried about kinetic war, you're better off buying a farm. During the short amount of time that the internet is shut down, you will likely be getting an ounce of silver for a loaf of bread. You'll also have something of immediate value to offer to the local militia, and they just might leave your gold alone :-)
  • CS
    C S.
    9 June 2017 @ 12:57
    Not sure why people think the store of value and medium of exchange must be the same thing.
  • Nv
    Nick v.
    9 June 2017 @ 12:29
    I think Raoul won this one. Great debate
  • PN
    Paul N.
    9 June 2017 @ 11:05
    Key argument at the end of the 1st section. The real (bitcoin) blockchain is only necessary for applications that need extreme security/anonymity/immutability/censorship resistance. Raoul is right that the majority of data doesn't need to be stored on this (and in fact the whole 'lets record everything on the blockchain' narrative is really silly. Why record stuff on a blockchain so it can't be edited?). Now... what needs those features? Digital bearer assets like bitcoin. And when would you want a bearer asset over a registered asset? Situations where you're afraid that someone will track it or take it from you (like Julian Assange). Situations where the current financial system is corrupt or broke (like Venezuela). Situations where you want to buy something privately because it's embarrassing or illegal (like porn & drugs). Women in the Middle East who can't get bank accounts. Hackers who want to ransom your data anonymously. People who want to bypass capital controls (China). And finally, people who just want to save their damn money (Gold 2.0). As far as I'm concerned sex, drugs, and rocknroll is what will drive Bitcoin to >$100K, and institutions will adopt it as an afterthought when enough customers are using it.
    • PN
      Paul N.
      9 June 2017 @ 11:10
      Regarding volatility: the trend in volatility in bitcoin is consistently down for the past several years. The hope is that if bitcoin goes mainstream the liquidity and market cap will be high enough that it becomes stable and trusted as a currency. For now though it's a speculative investment.
    • PN
      Paul N.
      9 June 2017 @ 11:21
      I expect that the true blockchain revolution will be recreating an entire digital financial system based on bearer assets and bottom-up user growth. It'll probably stay as a niche for a very long time until we start seeing the current system break down and trust in institutions collapses. However, as long as the current system works and everything's fine regular people won't need it.
    • BK
      Brian K.
      9 June 2017 @ 13:58
      Awesome discussion. Mark and Raoul are just fun to watch.
    • DR
      De R.
      9 June 2017 @ 17:12
      how about china over levered banking sector. @.@
    • NS
      Nathan S.
      9 June 2017 @ 19:49
      Ethereum blockchain technology is ahead of bitcoin at present imo. The smart contracts that can run code and execute if/when applicable are something bitcoin will never have. Also, the 1MB limited blocksize in bitcoin is a MAJOR hurdle to lower $ value transaction processing or simply the timely (think less than an hour) transaction processing times. Thanks to people at blockstream and other developers enjoying higher fee rates they wont support large block sizes. The smaller block sizes at bitcoin create a further problem as it scales... imagine more people attempting to move/transact bitcoins in a small window of time with these fixed 1MB blocks = more people wanting to transact which has driven transaction costs (paid to the mining pools) to sky rocket in late 2016 and 2017 so far. The mining pool is optimizing its transaction processing ability to generate the largest fee rates for the computers, hence why smaller blocks are a double edged sword for mainstream adoption. Anecdotally, someone in France on r/btc forum purchased a 1 euro cup of coffee for 1.67 euros (with 0.67 paid to mining pool). Overall, I just see ethereum as the blockchain with the most developer support that aligns with individual consumers potential uses for said cryptocurrency. Watch to one of Vitalik Buterin presentations on ETH on youtube for a better explanation of ethereum.
    • fa
      felix a.
      9 June 2017 @ 23:24
      Mark take a look at metalpay. Looks very interesting as a cross section between crypto, venmo.

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